DCnU Justice League Family

I thought this week's JL was nearly weaker than last week's and tied Avengers #25 as the weakest title I read this week. Not only did it feel like Johns was trying to be Bendis with his faux-witty banter but I still don't feel like this team is the JL.

Originally posted by Charles The only interesting thing about JL was the short revelation of the Martian Manhunter confrontation. The rest of the issue was used for shameless tie-ins to other books. This book only works as a soft reboot because Johns assumes you know everything about this team already. Amazo, Dark Side, and Manhunter are barely touched on with any depth. The only way you can coherently follow any of it is if you already have a decent grounded knowledge of the universe. Something I thought the reboot was trying to avoid.

Man Charles, I didn't even think about that. I took for granted my knowledge of DC and didn't even stop and say "Hey i totally get this issue because I've been reading DC books for almost 2 decades now" LOL...

Funny you mention that because Newsarama recently tried to reconcile JOhns soft-reboot with the harder reboot everyone else got:Grandfathered into Continuity

I think Grant Morrison spoiled me...his JL was the first big Justice League REBOOT/RESTART I ever read and it was AMAZING. Each issue and story felt like I was watching the world's greatest superheroes. Like I said Johns is channeling the worst of Bendis here...and it just gives us an average book.

Originally posted by Charles It's just surprising to me because John's JSA was absolutely claw-out-my-eyes amazing and this is so not.

I was going to say it might be the work load he has but Aquaman is great...I'm not reading Green Lantern anymore but I know alot of people who like it. So perhaps its just these characters? Perhaps he just can't click with them...

IDK...giving it away to editorial mandate is too easy and takes responsibility away from Johns himself...and its not like he's a low-level writer like Gischler writing X-Men. Hell I'm sure Johns gets away with stuff other writers sure can't.

Originally posted by Blackcyclops Like I said Johns is channeling the worst of Bendis here...and it just gives us an average book.

Which is why I consider both Johns and Bendis the two most over-rated and over-hyped writers today. Johns gets his hands on a character, does some cool things, sets up some intriguing concepts but then bails for some other character. I'm waiting to see how long he lasts with Arthur Curry.

I like Johns better when he has a co-writer. His first run on JSA was terrific and his run on Hawkman was amazing. But I'm scared to see what he is doing to Billy and Shazam. He was doing some good things previously with the Marvel Family, especially Black Adam (despite Johns' love of uber-violence) but here, with a 'new' direction, I'm extremely hesitant. Cap is a feel-good character. What is so wrong with that?

As for Lee, I see him as tainted now. He is part of the Editoral Trinity and I find his comments on the Alan Moore/Creator's rights regarding Before Watchmen troubling. He is more business-man than creator these days.

Of this lot of books, I'm only reading Flash. Manapul's art is stunning to say the least. Still not 100% sold on the tech-less Rogues, but the stories have been quite solid.

Johns is still good at Aquaman, Justice League just doesn't feel to be his thing. Doesn't make him bad at writing, just needs to do something else perhaps. Not every writer clicks with all things. And he really is not clicking with this. I haven't been this bored with a JLA title since the middling title that was in place around the time of before Infinite Crisis with Austen and Bryne and Claremont and such.

It just drags. Like Tyler said, the second arc should have been something epic. Not these really slow issues that are just meh. When it comes to the JLA I want to see epic stories of these heroes doing epic things. You got Superman and Wonder Woman and Green Lantern and Batman and Flash and such on one team...they should be taking on giant world threatening robots and alien invasions and all that sort of stuff. Instead we get whatever all this is.

And like BC I would not blame editorial. Johns is editorial now basically, he's one of the top three dudes within the comics portion for the most part. So I doubt anyone is really telling him to write like this.

And yes...this definitely ties with New Avengers #25 as a weak weak issue. Johns and Bendis might be better off just doing solo titles or something and leaving these big teams to others.

Another thing might also be that a lot of times writers that get content with their place in things start to sort of like let some things slide. They're not trying to forge their way in the industry as much cause they are billed as the top writers and the go to guys so they don't put as much effort into stuff sometimes. Same as a lot of people in jobs that get complacent.

I guess earth 2 falls under the justice league family right? Anyway, I thought it was kinda cool. The writing was kinda weak in spots but I love Nicolla Scott's art! Strange how this started with a Darkseid battle the same as Justice League...but I liked this fight better...cause the heroes got f' d up lol...I wasn't expecting that. I liked the introduction of flash here, but I do wonder since the JSA characters were changed so drastically ( younger...different origins...existing after superman and batman...no WWII setting) why not just incorporate them into Earth Prime?

Originally posted by UncannyScott Johns and Bendis might be better off just doing solo titles or something and leaving these big teams to others. Another thing might also be that a lot of times writers that get content with their place in things start to sort of like let some things slide. They're not trying to forge their way in the industry as much cause they are billed as the top writers and the go to guys so they don't put as much effort into stuff sometimes. Same as a lot of people in jobs that get complacent.

Except Johns did wonderful things on JSA for years with an even bigger roster. Something just isn't adding up with this book. Johns does not suffer from the pitfalls that Bendis does with any kind of frequency to justify a direct comparison.

Edited by Charles - 05-May-2012 at 9:10am

Earth 2 is good, but like Grief said a bit of dialogue is just wonky. The Batman near the end what he said to Robin just seemed a bit odd even for a Bruce about to die. It's a good concept though and seems more like old Robinson over the stuff he did the past few years for DC. Perhaps having his own sandbox to play in is helping again opposed to having the flagship team that editorial was breathing down the neck of writers back then.

Maybe that is Johns issue, the pressure of the flagship? *shrugs*. Yeah my comparison of him and Bendis is more about the complacency angle than their writing. I'd take Johns Aquaman any day of the year over Bendis Avengers. I just wanted to point out that both were writers that for the last years people were all over everything they did but now Bendis Avengers is mostly just middle of the line for most people without a lot of fanfare as it's just repeating things. Green Lantern was a huge book before but seems to be sort of just wavering with people lately though I've heard that changing some with Indigo stuff, and Justice League is sort of not really hitting for people.

Just making the note that a lot of times you look at these writers and the work they did early in the career where their place in the company wasn't firm as they could have been fired at any point, they still can of course, opposed to now where most are either up in the top editorial like Johns or are one of the big touted writers like Bendis and such. You reach that point, for any person in any career this is possible, near the top or you get complacent in your job as you've been there doing it for some time and you don't put your all into everything all the time anymore. You can squeak by a few products that aren't bad persay but are more middle of the line passable than stellar. Sometimes you'll still knock a ball out of the park and get the crowd going, but other times you'll just give them something that they enjoy but perhaps it's not anywhere near the best of that product out at the moment.

Totally agree on Flash. Barry has the personality of a tree and that is insulting to trees. Always mystified me that people wanted this husk of a person back as the Flash over Wally who had a lot of personality and traits and felt human.

And like Grief said, JSA isn't incorporated as they want the JLA heroes to be the team for the universe. Also they want the whole 'Heroes started five years ago' thing to work and JSA to them defeats that cause of them being the WWII heroes and such before. Though why they can't be brought in when de-aged like they are in Earth 2 is that first reason of DC wanting JLA to be THE team of the universe. Thus why the change of the name of this book from Justice Society to Earth II in the last few months.


Edited by UncannyScott - 05-May-2012 at 4:27pm

I guess wanting JLA to be THE super team is a good enough reason to separate out the earth 2 people. I was just surprised because I thought the ww2 origins of the Jsa was the main reason for the separation and with that angle not being used, the Jsa characters seem less problematic. Not complaining because I enjoy the prospects of having the Jsa exist in a different universe without the silver age guys to overshadow them.

Robinson stated in an interview on comicvine that there is only one Apocolypse and Darkseid in the multiverse so the invasion in this book is part of the same invading group from JLA. Interesting.

Originally posted by Blackcyclops I feel the same way about the Flash. I feel like Barry doesn't have any personality. And its making me care less about him and more about everything else.

My problem with Barry is that Johns was soooo hyped around Flash:Rebirth, that he was going to expand the Flash mythos  along the same lines as he had done with GL's mythos, expand the Flash Family. Instead, we got empty promises, cancelled mini-series, and no Wally.

Add to that, Johns' 09-11 run on Flash never really got to mature before it became an intro to Flashpoint. The first arc was decent but everything else after felt forced.

I think the current team has done better in portraying Barry.

As for Earth 2, I like Robinson better than Johns. I'm concerned however over the starting portrayal of Jay. It's one thing to be an 'everyman', it's something else to be a complete slacker. I hope he gets better but I do like the new source of his power.

(Also, there is the underlying fan theory that Jay is now a surrogate Wally, in that Wally started off as a slacker of sorts before starting down the road of a Hero. With Jay apparently doing the same here, fans of Wally might have to enjoy this vicariously through Jay)