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Blackcyclops
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Posted: 23-Oct-2011 at 6:11am |
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I agree with Charles on that one...they both are really products of their times...
The New Warriors are very much a Generation X team...a mash up of random characters, kinda random powers, and strange 90s style origins...
While the Runaways are all meta and kinda hipster-ish (costumes are so blase(sp) to them)...
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"And someone's mom wants to eat all their souls. As a mom, I was offended. Moms should get to be role models, too."-Savant
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das_boot
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Posted: 23-Oct-2011 at 1:28pm |
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Runaways holds a special place in my heart. I could do with the awful 3rd volume being entirely retconned though. The characters just didn't even sound right, especially under Immonen (seriously, HOW does she keep getting work?!), and they lost that BKV sparkle. If Runaways is done without him, it just wouldn't feel right. BKV writing, the amazing Jo Chen on covers, and anyone other than Ramos or Land on art. Preferably the original artist who's name currently escapes me.
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Ever wish you could receive life advice from one of your favourite characters? Send an email to comicadvicecolumn@gmail.com and see whose sage counsel you receive!
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RingOtaku
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Posted: 23-Oct-2011 at 4:28pm |
Originally posted by Charles
Both teams at their cores are a group of young people who reject older authority in order to make their own way in the super hero world. I agree the original ("Season One") run of Runaways fits into your description, but after that they pretty much turned into a better version of New Warriors. |
And that same concept had been done before by DC as the Teen Titans well before the New Warriors: A bunch of sidekicks who didn't need their "mentors" anymore despite their relative young age and lack of "solo" heroing experience. The fact is the original X-Men was the "fluke" in having a bunch of young heroes have a mentor they respected and eagerly followed. I still say it isn't the same because the New Warriors WANTED to be heroes: They dived into the deep end of the hero world and went looking for bad guys to bust. The Runaways were always reactive and dealing with threats that arose from their personal lives. In their own book you never saw the Runaways go "Hell Yeah let's go track down some villians that Iron Man hasn't noticed escaped prison. I bet if we capture the current Titanium Man then he will let us tour Avengers Mansion." If the Runaways are to be compared to anything it's Nextwave. Same meta-humor commentary on how absurd the tights and code-name aspect is. Same "Screw the rest of the heroes". Same "Please don't make us crossover" aspect. Which is why they tend to have a lot of the same fans.
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Alex I do everything like a hawk.
This isn't DC Comics -- Marvel continuity doesn't die out if you don't water it often enough.
The whole Batman idea is a very childish response to childhood trauma.
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Charles
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Posted: 24-Oct-2011 at 5:16am |
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After the Pride was taken out, there was a power vacuum within LA crime scene. The Runaways served as the "hero group" that dealt with those problems. They had to deal with, quite literally, the villains Iron Man wouldn't bother to chase. After season one, the Runaways for better or worst, were a super hero group. Granted, they never idolized the top-tier teams (or at least not eventually) but they still realized they were involved in their world.
While I get the loose comparisons you point out, Nextwave is really nothing like Runaways. Yes, they both had commentary on super heroes, but Runaways was a modern take (or reaction if you will) to it. While Nextwave was pure satire, not only about super heroes, but about the Marvel U as a whole.
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Formerly Charles Littlesky
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RingOtaku
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Posted: 24-Oct-2011 at 6:46am |
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And I don't "get" you saying Runaways was the same as New Warriors. The major thematic differences of the books speak against your theory. All you have is "they were both young and didn't have an Xavier". It's not really enough. As BC said New Warriors had more in common with Gen X.
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Alex I do everything like a hawk.
This isn't DC Comics -- Marvel continuity doesn't die out if you don't water it often enough.
The whole Batman idea is a very childish response to childhood trauma.
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Blackcyclops
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Posted: 24-Oct-2011 at 8:56am |
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Oh when I said Generation X, I actually meant the literal generation. New Warriors was all about the 90s. Runaways is the hipster version. Even there their hatred of costumes and superheroing is so hipster-ish lol...I'd say New Mutants were the 80s version and X-Men the 70s/60s version. I guess the Avengers Academy are the 2010s version perhaps.
I think there are definitely differences between New Warriors and Runaways. But a lot of those differences are the differences in the "youth" in those two different decades. I would actually like to read those two series side-by-side.
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"And someone's mom wants to eat all their souls. As a mom, I was offended. Moms should get to be role models, too."-Savant
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Charles
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Posted: 27-Oct-2011 at 9:33pm |
Originally posted by RingOtaku
And I don't "get" you saying Runaways was the same as New Warriors. The major thematic differences of the books speak against your theory. All you have is "they were both young and didn't have an Xavier". It's not really enough. |
The main point we don't see eye-to-eye on is that I believe the books thematic differences diminished once BKV restarted the series. By then, the Runaways were depicted every other week taking out another would be Z-lister who attempted to attack LA. It just wasn't the prime focus like with the New Warriors.
BC appears to agree with me, sighting that the jarring differences in tone come from a more modernized storytelling style and a different type of youth culture. Take those away and they are very much similar.
Hell, they both have even time traveled.
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Formerly Charles Littlesky
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Blackcyclops
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Posted: 27-Oct-2011 at 9:38pm |
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Somebody get BKV on the phone. I got an idea for a Runaways mini...have them travel through time to visit the New Warriors, New Mutants, and X-Men when they were young. So what if the MU is about 13-14 years old in their time. The New Warriors would be like 3-4 years back (so like the mid-2000s), New Mutants are like 6-8 years back (so like 2005-2003), and the original 5 were like in the mid 1990s...
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"And someone's mom wants to eat all their souls. As a mom, I was offended. Moms should get to be role models, too."-Savant
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XtremeOne1
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Posted: 27-Oct-2011 at 11:09pm |
Booo, calling the Runaways hipster is a mean thing to say. They didn't sit around while wearing lady jeans and uneeded, smoking weed and discussing the real meaning behind indie folk songs.
There is a large difference between being "hip"(not that anyone uses that word) and being a "hipster". I loathe hipsters, haha. Not wanting to wear costumes is just more of them just being kids(because the adults were costumes, not because it was out of style.)
Runaways forever!(just not in that mini you described BC, haha). I just don't like the thought of them joing a superhero team. It just doesn't suit any of the characters when we last saw them(I'm not counting volume 3 since that sucked.) I think the Runaways works best as teen drama/family title with some action thrown it. Really it's a coming of age tale and that's what they should focus on. The family dynamic, the kids coming into adulthood and what not.
And none of them are hipsters!(Gret was the closet but I'd call her more of a cynic then a hispter!) Hipsters are evil.
Edited by XtremeOne1 - 27-Oct-2011 at 11:12pm
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Blackcyclops
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Posted: 27-Oct-2011 at 11:19pm |
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What you described Xtreme is moreso a slightly limited idea of the term. I was moreso leaning towards this notion of skewing convention, seeing things like costumes (for example) as being passe'. I mean the New Warriors and New Mutants were kids and adults had costumes but still chose to wear them because of the type of youth they were portraying. Hipster in the broadest sense of the word is a cynical group that does not like the mainstream and supposedly does things their own way. All things that fit the Runaways. As someone who's done a small ethnography of several hipster subcultures I can say the Runaways fit this theme very well. The Runaways would never have fit in with the youth (see: late teens, 20 somethings) of the early 90s which were more grunge, gangsta rap based (not all of course) or the 80s. They were a group very historically specific.
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"And someone's mom wants to eat all their souls. As a mom, I was offended. Moms should get to be role models, too."-Savant
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XtremeOne1
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Posted: 27-Oct-2011 at 11:33pm |
I work in the city and graduated college in 2010, I know what a hispter is haha :-p. Cynical people who don't like the mainstream and do things their own way have existed since the mainstream existed. To widely label any cynic who doesn't like the mainstream as a hipster is a bit much.
But yeah this isn't the topic for that.
This is the topic to discuss bringing Runaways back!
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Blackcyclops
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Posted: 27-Oct-2011 at 11:46pm |
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Never said that, albeit I didn't go on further with the elaboration because I thought it would sufficient. Apparently it didn't LOL...either way, as you say it's not for this thread...
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"And someone's mom wants to eat all their souls. As a mom, I was offended. Moms should get to be role models, too."-Savant
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Wolverinefan86
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Posted: 05-Nov-2011 at 4:26am |
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All the other Spider-Man books.
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"You always liked Pushing around people smaller than you! Well, I'm smaller! Try pushing me! Raaaaaaah!" Wolverine Deadly reunions the 90s X-Men cartoon
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Wolfthomas
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Posted: 07-Nov-2011 at 2:31am |
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Cable and Deadpool, this book would be especially relevant given the post-shism enviroment, Deadpools involvement with Uncanny X-men, Generation Hope on Utopia. Return Cable to the dry humoured philosophical chessmaster and continue to redeem Deadpool with character developement.
Or just Cable, if he's coming back he might as well be used. He's really a great one for interacting with different teams due to his past history, Cable guest featuring this issue Generation Hop/Uncanny X-men/Uncanny X-force/X-factor/New Mutants/Adjectiveless X-men would all work.
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